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Episode Overview

Today's clients expect far more from their accountant than accurate financial statements and tax compliance. They want proactive advice, technology-driven insights, and access to a trusted network of experts who can help them navigate increasingly complex business challenges. As AI reshapes the profession, accountants who continue to operate the same way risk falling behind.

In this episode, The Connected Accountant producer Anthony Pearl is joined by Wayne Findlay of The Back Room, Talila Croy of Emple, and Ian Aldridge of Progressive Legal to discuss how client expectations have evolved and what accounting firms need to do to keep pace.

The panel explores how AI is creating new opportunities for accountants to become trusted advisers, why proactive client communication matters more than ever, and how building a structured ecosystem of strategic partners enables firms to deliver greater value without doing everything themselves. The conversation also highlights the importance of systems, relationship rhythms, and intentional partnership management to create stronger client outcomes.

If your firm wants to deepen client relationships, embrace AI with confidence, and future-proof its advisory offering, this episode provides practical ideas to help you stay ahead.

What You'll Learn

• How client expectations are changing in the AI era
• Why AI creates more opportunities for advisory—not fewer
• How technology enables accountants to become more proactive with clients
• Why strategic partnerships allow firms to deliver more value without expanding their team
• How to build and prioritize a trusted partner ecosystem
• The importance of consistent client and partner communication
• Why systems and relationship rhythms are essential for sustainable growth

Transcript

ANTHONY: Has the client changed? Have you? Welcome to the Connected Accountant, the podcast where we explore how strategic partnerships can transform your accounting practice. I'm your co-host, Anthony Pearl, and today we're discussing [music] how the modern client has evolved and where the professionals are keeping pace with new technology and partnership strategies.

TALILA: You can't do everything yourself. And so the power of giving clients more when the clients change is actually being able to introduce the right people at the right time and have that network, that trusted network around you.

WAYNE: If you could position yourself, especially as an accountant, that you're an AI expert or you know the tools, you can help your client and showcase what you can do. There's a lot of opportunities that will come out of that.

IAN: Most people say they're relationship driven. But how how are you relationship driven? By sending a newsletter every month. That's not a relationship.

ANTHONY: Joining me today are our three regular panelists who bring incredible expertise [music] to the connected accountant. We have Tila Croy from Emple, Wayne Finley from the back room, and Ian Aldridge from Progressive Legal. So, let's get into what will make you [music] the connected accountant. Well, hello Wayne, Ian, and Talila. Welcome to another episode of the podcast. And I guess we've got to kick off this one by saying the client has changed. Have you? I think this is a really interesting one. And Wayne, I'm going to kick it off with you because I know this is a topic that is dear to you with lots of changes of foot.

WAYNE: Yeah, a lot of change happening especially in the accounting space. So the client, you know, has I think it's opened up a lot more tools basically that the accountants can talk with their clients. There's a lot more resources out there and the ability to be able to add value to the clients through these tools is pretty awesome at the moment. If you're accountant, I think it is an opportunity rather than a threat that there's just so much you can do with the client now that you couldn't do before with all these advisory tools and making your compliance a lot easier so you can focus more on the client. And I think it's time to double down on that client relationship.

WAYNE:  Yeah.

ANTHONY: Technology has become a really significant thing in the accounting space particularly, hasn't it? It's just it's something that you can't overlook.

WAYNE: Yeah, exactly. You I just saw something yesterday that Xero and Claude uh partnering. So that means within Xero, you're going to be able to access Cord. So that's going to open up a lot of opportunities for added value there. And I'm I'm an Excel guru. I'm not a guru. I no glad that it's I'm not I'm a I'm a novice sometimes, but I try to do too much and I've just found claude for Excel and that is brilliant. So, in that accounting space, it just makes it so much easier now to to to do a lot of reconciliations and bits and pieces. It's so much easier.

IAN: That's amazing that I'm going to have to get into my zero a bit more and uh use Claude. Um, we're actually going through a a bit of a sort of a look at all the numbers at the moment with the assistance of a colleague who actually Talila referred me to and she's been wonderful and getting us understand our numbers a bit more. But yeah, I'll definitely be using some of those tools. We've implemented an AI legal assistant in the business called AI legal assist. It's going to be rebranding shortly. But yeah, we're seeing some benefits of that. lots of benefits of just just double-checking everything at the moment just to make sure we haven't missed anything and doing some heavy lifting on some really really voluminous and awful documents and where there's lots and lots and lots of documents as well to look at those and do some of that heavy lifting first which obviously means that you know our staff are happier cuz they're not having to do that heavy lifting or they're just looking at discrete stuff which is really good but yeah I was just thinking as well too Wayne you know me as a client of a of an accountant you know to have that data and even if it's like just from real-time data every every sort of once in a while that's automated even from your accountant to kind of give you sort of a heads up of where you're at on a timely basis so you sort of know where your numbers are at. That would be something that I reckon that blow most clients away.

TALILA: I agree. I think a lot of us want more proactivity from our accountants and it's the opportunity for accountants to go beyond compliance and at the same time it's the opportunity for accountants to spend more time with clients care about clients more because client always comes first and build partnerships that provide the client with who they need and I think as you said Ian you actually met I know the lady you're talking about probably be a good guest for this podcast at one point she ask because Wayne ran that round table for accountants and she came. So the networks grow and as our networks grow we add more value to offer to our clients and the client has changed and the client is getting more demanding to be frank.

IAN: Yeah 100%. They're expecting more and if not but no one seems to be changing. So if you do you'll stand out so much in that gray environment. Right.

WAYNE: Yeah. I think if you could position yourself, especially as an accountant, that you're an AI expert or you know the tools, you can help your client, then I think that's that's going to leverage yourself and that's that's an opportunity for partnerships. I think you in to you do some run some events or you do some activities that you can bring these other people in and showcase what you can do with clients and then you Yeah, there's there's a lot of opportunities that will come out of that. Definitely.

TALILA: Absolutely. We're running an accounting and advisory partner suitcase right now, which is our partner suitcase with six businesses in the accounting and advisory space. And one interesting story that's come out of that is that um one of the professionals in there that was helping a a client to sell a business introduced another professional at the right time. That added 4 million to the client's sale. Now, you can't do everything yourself. And so the power of giving clients more when the clients change is actually being able to introduce the right people at the right time and have that network, that trusted network around you.

ANTHONY: Ian, I mean, get to the original topic that we've got here about the client changing. I think one of the premises that's really important is to actually understand the client in the first place and and visually understanding them and understanding where you sit in relation to them. I know that's a topic that's that's close to you as well.

IAN: Yeah. I think the more practice in every client that we speak to and as I mentioned on the previous podcast is one of the first questions we ask a client is, do you have a good accountant? because we know that like we can do all the fancy legal stuff but you know all the words but if the numbers don't work they're going out of business and there's lots of businesses that obviously you know accountants will advise that you know they'll look at the numbers and go these these numbers don't seem to work and you advise them pretty heavily on it. what we just value that that relationship with the accountant just so so crucial for success for a business and we love accountants. We love dealing with accountants and helping the clients understand both the legal and the accounting input. In the vast majority, the advice is consistent, but there are sometimes where the legal advice and the financial tax advice differs. But we want to make sure that that that everyone's on the same page and there's no one sort of giving, you know, different advice, then the client goes, "Oh, who do I believe here?" And then they start to lose trust in both their accountant and their law wondering who's right, who's wrong, and why. They don't understand fundamentally there sometimes can be a difference between legal and and financial advice and gets us on top of the matter really quickly is to get a diagrammatic representation of what the business looks like. And if there is a proposed change in the structure of it, what what it is, what is it now and what does it look like when that changes and have as much detail as possible. we've just sort of found a very big left and right of arc with the detail that's sort of put on on those things and sometimes we get a piece of paper with some scribbles on it and other times we get a pretty diagram that's done on either some software that actually explains it really well to a lay person who are the directors shareholders what company owns what what's the proposed move what needs to move from here to here and actually get on the same page with the accountant but most circumstances and I'm telling you guys as accountants when I'm asking the clients about the structure of the business unless they've spoken to you that day and remember everything. They don't know. They they really don't know. Some of them can barely tell me who the directors of the companies are or shareholders or whether it's a um a trust with a corporate trustee who's trustee of a trust. Like they don't they just don't remember. And to be honest, sometimes I have to refamiliarize myself with the structure of my business sometimes too just to make sure okay and I've got that diagrammatic representation. That helps me enormously. So that's a really really good thing. I was just sort of thinking as Wayne was talking like obviously now with the AI tools you might be able to just give the documents to the AI and say please give me a diagrammatic structure representation of the of the structure of it without having to do.

WAYNE: Guaranteed is something like that guaranteed and I can see the real use of that I can see the benefit having that central document so you can access that jointly it's it should be in the old days of files that would be the first thing that you would tape on the inside of that file, you know, the structure of that client. So, yeah,

IAN: Quite honestly, I think that that sort of diagrammatic representation is only sort of been more recently sort of recognized as necessary because we're all vis we're visual creatures and most clients are visual. So, they they need to see what it looks like, not just like here are the documents and kind of figure it out themselves. And I think as well it just means that when we are changing structure from like soul trader to a company or you know a more complicated structure with holding companies and with license agreements and all the rest and trading entities that for a client really does get like oh overwhelm without that sort of diagram to show them exactly what it's going to look like

ANTHONY: Talila that diagnostic representation is something that is of value in a partnership structure as well isn't it? Because being able to see yourself and what you offer and then what are the other things that you might be able to offer to cover a greater piece of work is a huge advantage to be able to just even just internally from a perspective of having that representation.

TALILA: Yeah, we actually have a similar diagrammatic representation of what a partner ecosystem should look like actually around a business. You know, who are the partners? And it's one of the things we go through in the partner suitcase program is literally if you had to build your own ideal ecosystem from scratch, who would be in it and why? And we always talk about there being tier 1, tier 2, tier three partners, like a lawyer and accountant should be a tier one partner for each other cuz they cross over all the time and they need each other all the time. And then you know you've got different layers of how relevant the partners are to you because not not because of anything like you're not judging them. It's just how much do your clients need that partner and how crucial to your work or the client's outcomes is that partner to you and so we have that diagrammatic representation to build a partner ecosystem. Is that what you were referring to Anthony?

ANTHONY: Yeah absolutely. Yeah, I think it's such an important tool for people to have cuz it helps them understand how much more that they can cover, right? That that's where I helps you identify where the gaps are that you might need a partnership and then helps you extend that and then being able to deliver that to clients and say we can cover all of these things because of our network is a huge advantage you can have as a business. You don't want to build that haphazard. You want to actually be quite strategic and go here's the people that I meet in my ecosystem and this is why. And every one of those has got to be trusted and tried and true that you can rely on them 100%. Because that takes away the fear of sharing a client. When you've got the good partnership structures in place, you can work together and without adding any team members, you've basically got an extended team in your business because you built it through partners. That's the beauty.

ANTHONY: And Wayne, I think it's, you know, again, the role the technology plays in understanding all of this and keeping track of all of these things is important on one hand, but it's also recognizing that businesses are changing at such a rapid rate that you need to have a consistent review process, right? To understand that and keep on top of what your clients are doing. So that there's a value having someone taking ownership in particularly in an accounting firm of mapping out where clients are at and representing what they're about and what how you can assist them.

WAYNE: Yeah. Well, that's right. I think the accountant always wants to be the trusted advisor and 80 90% of the time that's the case with their clients and so having that map you know what Talila talked about is along with having structured you your second diagram should be who your partners are that you're dealing with who's your first circle you know your lawyer your banks your insurance you know these type of people and then the second layer there might be other people that you can partner with as well. And so I think that would be something that you should have on each file and that's a discussion that you can have with the client as well and also with your when you're talking to your lawyer or other people. It would be worthwhile having that discussion

IAN: with your with that inner circle. Is that Wayne sort of like the parto sort of principle that sort of looking at the top 20% of your referral partners and focusing on them first at least.

WAYNE: I think it is it's the 8020 rule. Uh yeah you 20% you'll get 80% of your work from 20% of um you know your partnerships. So the ones that are you you focus on the big ones. That's what we've done.

IAN: We've sort of or at least identify them first. Right.

WAYNE: Identify the big ones that work. you because you can't be everything to everybody. If you have a 100 partnerships and you're just going to spend all your time just trying to deal with relationships that are you'll just get nowhere. You won't have any time. But if you focus and double down on the ones that will generate you the most, your scale, then that's more effective use of your time and you'll get a far better result. That's sort of what we've done anyway and it's worked for us.

TALILA: That's right. we've built in and I think Wayne when you went through the process particularly and now it's now automated something where you can basically score the existing partners you have that not only score them but also identify who do you need in your ecosystem through a series of questions that really touch on client need the relevance and how important it is to the client and then even more than that how often it comes up and then those becoming the people that you need to fill and you look at the ones you've got first and how much you trust them and then you go out and do the rest with a real strategy around it and that's incredibly like it works incredibly well and we can't go and partner with everybody and I spoke to actually an accountant recently and he's a member of a networking group and he says lovely people he's shown up every day every week for a year had these great chats and not a single referral has ever come out of it it's like do not do random networking right understand who who we need and why we need them. Go to them with a very clear client focused partner value proposition. Build trust with them and then they are your ecosystem. They are your orchard that you have planted.

WAYNE: Yeah. I think we're we're our own worst enemy sometime and we're just not direct enough, aren't we? You know, we we go out and have a coffee and we have a good chinwag about stuff, but we never get down to business and say, "Hey, let me help you, you help me." um you know how can we make it better for each other and I I just don't think we're direct

IAN: Also too I've just noticed recently um and this is all you know part of the work that we've done with Talila sort of encouraged my team as well and making a sort of a regular meeting just to get them thinking about their referral partners but also just encouraging them every week here and there just sort of saying hey have you reached out to your latest five sort of great referral partners that you've got even if it's just to to call them you may not get through but even if it's just to leave a message and say, "Hey, just wanted to pick up the phone cuz I know we haven't spoken in a while. Wanted to see how things are going. Hope you're well. Nothing specific, but just wanted to check in and say hi." It takes no time at all. Obviously, it takes more time if they pick up the phone, but most people are pretty busy. And even if they do, that's great opportunity to ask them more about where they're at. Just front and center of mind at all times. It's it's really starting to pay dividends now. We're starting to get lots of referrals that are coming through now to Talila. Um, you'll be happy to happy to know. And that's all all from that work that we did, you know, towards the end of last year. It's starting to work and just sweeping up these leaves and just keeping in touch with everyone. And it's not hard and they like you and they want to speak with you and they want to say say hi.

TALILA: Everybody is honored to be part of a good partnership. And I think too that one of the things we've built in again people can drop the ball when they're building partnerships in a number of areas. Wayne just mentioned one, not being clear and direct, right? Another one Ian is not keeping the rhythm up.

IAN: Yeah, the rhythm, that rhythm

TALILA: doing all of those things, being client focused, being direct, keeping the rhythm up, being very clear on value, being very clear on what we're doing for each other. Uh having a rhythm that goes on throughout the year. And the the difference is random vague nothingness to complete partners in business, like real growth. And the difference too is that partnerships are never still. They're either going backwards or they're moving forwards. Like everything in life, they're like a plant. And when it's young, it needs a bit of love and nurturing and attention so it can grow big. And if you build them right, they will give you much more fruit in year two than year one and year three than year two. They're actually expanding. And uh this is the fun thing. And we don't just partner with our ecosystem of um adjacent people. We can also partner with our clients particularly. I know you do that way. You actually partner with large accounting groups, don't you? and you help them to get their member firms certain results as well.

WAYNEl Yeah, it's something that's you know good for us. We try to partner with the different groups of accountants or franchises or I forget what you call them but there is a lot of them there and so we can do that in different countries as well. So not only New Zealand, Australia, there's the UK, you know, US, Canada. So these groups are everywhere. So you get one and then you're across the whole globe and so then you have to reach each country. So it's uh you know some of them are you know are really good to deal with and there's different things that we can do through training through some of the software we're doing and the allocation of resources that can benefit the groups across their network. So yeah, it's a win-win type situation for us.

ANTHONY: Ian, I just I want to pick up on a point that you raised a little while back as well in terms of keeping in contact with people because we go back to the premise of of this particular episode that we're talking about has the client changed? Have you the only way you can find out if the client has changed is if actually contact them in the first place and ask the question what's new? What's happening in your place and make adjustments to the things that you've got in place and help them with that? Yeah, 100%. And um I mean we're all really busy too. And even if it's a call or a message or even just an email, you know, just something, you know, just say, "Oh, you popped in my head the other day late at night now, so it's too you're too late to call you, but I just thought I'd send you a quick email and just see how you were and we can line up a chat if you want to speak tomorrow or Thursday's looking good at the moment um afternoon this time." Like just keep extending that olive branch out. And it's just so funny as well too cuz we all know like how busy we get in our own business and businesses are just getting busier and busier. Like it's really really challenging. So having like those reminders and and even if it's getting someone from your office to give them a call and just say hey you know um Steve just asked me to give you a quick buzz just to check in and say hi. Like that's the same almost the same as you calling them. But like it's still the same thought. Their account manager and just asked me to give you a quick buzz cuz he wants to know where you're at. hasn't spoken to you a while and just wanted to see you all right and especially if things are like really busy for them or they're going through a tough time or whatever it is. Yeah, that can mean the world to people that you actually care. You're showing you care about them. This is actually walking the walk, not just talking the talk. Most most people say they're relationship driven, but how how are you relationship driven by sending a newsletter every month? That's not a relationship.

TALILA: That's a good point. And another thing I' I'd like to add is because we do sales process and I think what we're different about is we treat partnership process as a sales process. You get really client focused, you get the partner that you need, have the chats with them, you get to an a result. But we just work with an accounting firm in Melbourne, incredible accounting firm, very profitable, very successful. They get 100% of their leads from clients.They were referred to us. And one of the things that's interesting there is that even with them, that proactive outreach of finding about out about the client still only happens insufficiently. It doesn't happen quarterly or regularly where you literally contact the client and find out what's going on and share what you've seen from their books. And that was just one of the little things that immediately changed things because you can't help someone if you're not in touch with them. And even when they would bring it up in annual reviews, because there hasn't been much contact for the entire year, there's just not that relationship of trust and connection for the client to take the annual review feedback in the same way as if there'd been a quarterly or a regular contact with a bit of structure to it and a bit of care. As you said,

IAN: You got to schedule that. The software is available to remind you. You know, you can put stuff in and make it a calendar reminder and set it every quarter, you know, whatever it is, just to just to check in with them or yeah, people will pop into your head every now and then, you know, and just write it down say, "Yeah, I've got to get in contact with them and make sure you call them and have but better better to have a system, right?" So, because you can't trust your memory now cuz we're just getting I mean, I know my RAM I'm I'm running out of RAM pretty fast. of getting 250 plus emails a day and trying to remember every person's name and every matter and everything and everyone like it's getting harder. It really is getting harder and harder. Time is the most important resource now, right? But

TALILA: systems are

IAN: But dedicating that time and that and that strategy and the like like you say the rhythm just keeping in contact with those at the very least the really really good clients and if you and if you can dedicate the time like Wayne said about you know face to face catch up nothing beats face to face. Yeah. Making the time for it. That's the thing right.

TALILA: Need a system too. We had a professional services firm that just recently that we've been working with. That's one of the ones we're working with right now. They have over 100 referral partners. And going back to the 8020 rule, most of their work comes from just four or five, but they have over a hundred, but no formal agreement. And basically, there's 80 that's pretty much fow and there's no system or rhythm or shared understanding or structure or anything that keeps the others going. And I think yes, we need care. We need systems to help us in this busy time to remember what to do and and keep it.

WAYNE: It it's a common thing with accountants, especially directors and partners, that they're too busy. Yes. To spend time with partnerships. And so that that happened to Scott and I when we were accounting. And so what we did was we just analyzed what we were doing um down to our admin, down to what clients we were dealing with. And so we just cut out all we call it the crap, call it the admin. We hired a business manager to deal with all that. And then with the clients, we just did the ABCD. You know, if they're an A client, then we would deal with them direct. BC, CC's, and D's, you know, the D's were deletes. And the the B's and C's went to to the the next level down to the senior managers, and we gave them more responsibility with them. So, it was a bit tough at the time, but it worked. It freed us up. It It really freed us up to spend more time with their clients, the good ones that we wanted to grow. And we also had more time to work on bringing more stuff into the firm.

IAN: Now, considering as well too that work on partnerships is actually one of my key drivers and core highest and best use in the business cuz no one else can really do it, right?

WAYNE: Yes.

IAN: And they're probably from a longevity perspective the best investment you can make because the prospect is they'll bring in more and more great clients. And of course you also be you one of your highest best uses is the supervision and the technical work as well too. But one of your other highest and best use is bringing in more work cuz you can't rely on juniors to do that. That's not in their wheelhouse. They're not ready. They're not there yet. You know, only you are.

TALILA: You don't want difficult work to bring in. So if you build partnerships and the actual sales process is is effortless almost. So it is a fantastic use of time but because it's strategic rather than urgent people often put it off or feel like that's something they'll just get to. And uh I think that's the whole purpose. It's like the people that all the professionals that went into partner suitcase, they've had to make the time and I can see how busy they all are, but they're progressing through it building their partner value proposition, identifying their ecosystem, which is very similar to what you had, Wayne, with your ABCD clients. There's basically ABCD partners, not because D is not just as good quality of a person as A, but because of the relevance to to you and your firm and what you need.

WAYNE: And that's in your profile, isn't it, Talila? getting the ICP, you know, what what's your ideal client profile that you want and being able to tell your partners about that and then they can deliver more of that for you. You don't want referrals of D clients, you know, these normally refer these.

TALILA: So, very true.

IAN: How many how many and how many times have you heard, you know, clients tell you, "Oh, I didn't know you did that." Or referral partners say, "I didn't know you did that." You're like, "Oh, Ben, I need to educate you more."

TALILA: You know, that's why we brought in that whole system of education. I don't think they say that to you anymore, Ian. And I think that's the important thing like uh we we don't take things for granted. Onboarding a partner is like onboarding a client, but they're onboarding you as well. You're on boarding each other. So, it's kind of fun and but you have to know each other just as well as you know a client and as well as a client. You've got to be like a client checking them for everything. you know, commercial alignment, trust, accuracy, quality of service, client communication, values, it all comes together into something very special.

IAN: And and we found too just on that point that having those regular like having an initial cadence to really kind of understand because I don't expect people to remember everything when we do that partnership presentation to them. we have to have another meeting and find out about them and give and give us the opportunity to ask them any questions or you know refresh and just make sure that it's sort of implanted in their mind exactly what we do exactly what we do because you know um we now have less memory than a goldfish as we've um as we established last time and and that's why I can't wait for you guys to joining partner I'm so glad that one of your team sat in on our session yesterday because it literally on boards the partner walks them through your stuff everything your I feel partners, your exclusive offers, your value proposition, what you agreed together, the whole thing, and keeps it top of mind with the action plan that when you next meet, you've all got it in front of you, and they can put all their stuff in, too. So, incredibly solves all of the goldfish brain slippage and makes sure that everyone's really aligned.

ANTHONY: Just to wrap up this discussion, I just want to relay a story particularly to you because of a partnership that happened because of your introduction things where it added a value that maybe people don't think about. So in the particular case, a shared client that we've now developed actually has gone through a personal health issue and by sharing information between the two partners, we were able to not pressure the person, keep in contact with them and remain trusted with that person so that now they're at the end of that particular crisis. And so we're able to maintain the relationship. And I think what was really important was that being in partnership enabled us to work together on that. And I think that's another side value of of keeping in touch with what has changed with a client and being able to work in partnership to make sure you can manage that process.

TALILA: That's right. And that's that's the beauty of it. Just you are really holding the client together. So, and you're achieving the outcome together. So, as I said, it's like moving a piece of furniture with four people holding the sides of the table instead of one. And that's emotional as much as physical. It's it's every level. You're That's a really great example, Anthony. Actually,

ANTHONY: While that's all we have time for in this conversation, there's plenty more coming up in the connected [music] accountant. Next time, we're going to dive into the art of being intentional. [music] Talila introduces us to the partner suitcase and explains why building partnerships for accountants shouldn't be left to chance. [music] If you want to move from accidental referrals to a strategic system that actually delivers, you won't want to miss it. Don't forget as well that you can download a special workbook from today's episode with all information on what's been said and action steps to follow so [music] you can be on your way to becoming the connected accountant. A reminder also about some exclusive roundt events for accountants. [music] Visit the show notes for dates and information on where you can register as well as all the contact information for Talila, Wayne, and [music] Ian. This is a partner alchemy podcast for thought leaders, a joint venture between Emple and my team at podcastdoneforyou.com.au. [music] I'm Anthony Pearl reminding you to like, share, comment, and subscribe so you never miss an episode. See you next time on the connected accountant.

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